Forum Activity

[Patmo]

Marty

I don't disagree with the usefulness of linking the national forum from the local forums.  I would also like to see everyone that is organizing a "MSTA" event post it up on the EVENTS CALENDAR on the national forum.  I believe that the calendar is a very much underutilized aspect of the forums, and possibly the most useful tool to increasing usage of the forum we have.

[Patmo]

I don't do Facebook.

Pretty much until last year I didn't either.  I started using it to stay in touch with my far flung family, especially my kids/grandkids and nieces/nephews.  I got tired of my wife telling me that I would know what they were doing if I would just check Facebook.  LOL

However, as I side effect I found that there is A LOT of MOTORCYCLE content on Facebook that can't be found anywhere else.  I've also been able to reconnect with some childhood friends, and some HS/college friends I hadn't seen in 30 years.

It's been good for me.....your results may vary.   

[VersysRider]

Great organization, but very closed and protective.  Generally only positive and supportive posts are welcomed.  Holds the number of posts down.

And a troll post it is. Another negative post from GSRider2Up in a public forum area. All that was asked was that negative comments about the club be posted in the member's only sections or addressed to the EC directly by email. The MSTA forum is a promotional tool, so do you expect negative posts in public area to be accepted? A corporation wouldn't allow it, neither should the MSTA. All of your concerns were discussed and addressed appropriately, no matter how assanine they have been. Too bad for you that things didn't go your way. After more than 4 years, it's time to get over it and move on.

As for the other posts in this thread, this has been a healthy conversation that the next webmaster can analyze and work from. Keep the discussion and suggestions going. While all of the issues can't be addressed, there is certainly much room for improvement and this thread will go a long way in helping the next guy make these improvements.

[DirtFlier]

[You know the best part of not being an officer any longer? I get to complain and criticize with impunity every decision the officers make, just like some are apt to do. No more need to bite my tongue and provide polite, level headed, reasoned responses...Choon]

For many, it's just too easy to be on the outside and throw rocks - not offer constructive ideas, or even offer to help.

Tosh

[96viffer]

[You know the best part of not being an officer any longer? I get to complain and criticize with impunity every decision the officers make, just like some are apt to do. No more need to bite my tongue and provide polite, level headed, reasoned responses...Choon]

For many, it's just too easy to be on the outside and throw rocks - not offer constructive ideas, or even offer to help.

Tosh

I hope that folks, especially for those who know me, reading this realize that my statements were made facetiously. Until I volunteered, I had absolutely no idea the amount of time, effort and commitment it took to keep this club running. Every decision is discussed and voted on. No decision is made lightly. Every officer I had the honor to serve with, past and present, never had any sort of personal agenda and only had the best interest of the club at heart.

As Tosh said, it's all too easy to cast aspersions, some personal, at the officers. It never ceases to amaze me how quickly these same people back pedal when approached to help with the club. "No time" seems to be a very common excuse. Alrighty then, how about having a little consideration for those who are giving their time?

Choon

[GSRider2Up]

Jon, what negative comment?  Great organization - and the rest is very true.  The Forum is very closed and protective.  Just saying as it is.  I've not posted anything for a very long time and people were asking why the Forum is not utilized more and I posted a reason why some people might not use the Forum more.

[GSRider2Up]

Tosh,
I would hope you weren't targeting me in your comment about throwing stones.  I once worked as a club volunteer on the club's web content.  I have been in contact with a number of club presidents and board members with suggestions.  I had volunteered to chair a national web/electronic club presence.  I have written some best IT practices documents for the club.  As was stated at the top of this thread, our Forum does not have a great level of participation and if people are serious about doing something about it, you have to have a serious discussion about why that is.  As to my recent post, as I stated, a great organization, but it is a very closed and protective group.  I've seen a number of members get chewed up and even board member. 

[VersysRider]

Jon, what negative comment?  Great organization - and the rest is very true.  The Forum is very closed and protective.  Just saying as it is.  I've not posted anything for a very long time and people were asking why the Forum is not utilized more and I posted a reason why some people might not use the Forum more.

That is not how your original post reads, it reads as if you were saying the organization is closed and protective. Anyway, this is not the case, even with the forum. Here's what gets you banned or warned: Political discussion, Religious discussion, and continual posting of negative comments about the club in a public forum area. Now, if the beef with the club or leadership is posted in a member's only area, then fine, as long as it's not threatening. Oh yeah, one other thing could get you banned, continually pissing off the admin, and that's only happened to one person. So, the forum isn't really closed and restrictive. The real reason? It's a dying form of communication. Facebook, Google+ and the like are slowing taking the audience of forums. Even vBulletin's new "forum" software (our former forum software) works more like Facebook than a traditional forum. That's not to say the forum doesn't serve as a useful tool for the MSTA. But eventually, several years down the road, no one will remember the MSTA forum.

On another note, the club desperately needs a forum administrator. I have heard this guys crap for more than four years and am done with it, he doesn't know when to quit. Please contact vice-president@ridemsta.com if you are interested. Notice that there is no "Forum Administrator" title under my name. I don't have admin access any longer so the forum will not receive any updates or maintenance until a volunteer steps up.

[fartymarty]

On another note, the club desperately needs a forum administrator. I have heard this guys crap for more than four years and am done with it, he doesn't know when to quit. Please contact vice-president@ridemsta.com if you are interested. Notice that there is no "Forum Administrator" title under my name. I don't have admin access any longer so the forum will not receive any updates or maintenance until a volunteer steps up.

It feels like I just got here and people are already fleeing. I get that a lot, especially after I've had some french onion soup (re:screen name), but I haven't had any lately. 

Childish funnies aside, Jon please don't quit. If you don't want to read or moderate the forum for blood pressure and/or quality of life reasons, fine. Please keep the maintenance going until a qualified replacement comes along. If the forum dies (once again if I understand the groups history) then let it be because it self destructed, not because (said months and years from now) "We used to have a forum, but Jon quit, and it folded."

Thanking you in advance Jon, for any reconsideration on your part.

(Can I get second?...anybody...anybody? {well, no not really anybody, Alan, just for now     Please.})

[RIDEMYST]

Well said FaryMarty!
I started this thread as a constructive dialog to help improve member participation. I'm concerned I've created negative feelings towards the forum and more so people that donate so much of their personal time. -JEP-


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[VersysRider]

Guys,

My statements have nothing to do with the thread itself. Also, GSRider2Up's statements are not the sole reason, they just helped me make the decision much easier. Here's the  ugly truth...A few days ago I received 2 different emails from 2 different members that more or less attacked my integrity and questioned my capabilities to be a volunteer for this club. Keep in mind, I've been doing this for the club for 8+ years and served on the EC as well, along with other numerous volunteer activities along the way. I proceeded to send out my resignation to the EC, not just from my volunteer duties but from the club as well. After an email exchange from a couple of EC members I agreed to continue to update the website, with some stipulations, one being I will no longer support the forum and the other was that my email be removed as the main contact for the club. With my email being the one that the contact us functions on the forum and website goes through, every complaint and bitch goes through me and is generally directed at me. After 8 years of this, I'm done, it wears on a person after awhile and it wasn't what I signed up for when I volunteered to do this. I have reached the point where I can no longer bite my tongue, and that doesn't represent the club well. So my decision was to remove myself.

Out of 1700 members, there are 5 or so that are the issue. This is well known to most of the club volunteers. The ones I have issue with have no doubt who they are as they have received a reply to their emails in the last couple of days. These would probably be considered unprofessional for a club representative. I was speaking on behalf of myself and not the MSTA. Know that I am not the only volunteer that has resigned over this type of crap, and I doubt that I will be the last. This has been an ongoing problem for many years.

For the most part, volunteering for the club is a rewarding and enjoyable experience. I've made a lot of friends along the way. But there comes a time when a person decides they've had enough. I've had enough. Will I continue to be a MSTA member? Odds are yes, but I may take a break for a bit.  Will I speak badly about the club?  Never!  This is really one of the best motorcycle clubs around.

Have no fear, the forum software will run fine for quite some time without any interaction. There is maintenance that will eventually need to be done, I'm sure someone will volunteer to take care of it.

Here's a plea to the handful that are a pain in the ass. Think before you send that email to someone who is volunteering to help build a club for you to enjoy. Are you being belligerent? If so, don't send it. Have you sent the email about the same subject before and gotten a reply? Yes? Quit beating a dead horse. Don't send it. Have you offered reasonable potential solutions? No? Don't send it. And also, if you are not willing to step up and help out, don't expect to get exactly what you want. The are many volunteers in the club, by percentage it's probably the highest of any. Just about every interaction you have with the MSTA requires a volunteer, even getting fed at an event. Show some respect to those volunteers, without them you don't have a club to bitch about.

I'll most likely be scolded for this post, but it needed to be said.

Please continue on with this post as I said before. There are constructive thoughts here and hopefully some constructive solutions will come from it. The post itself is not an issue.

[GSRider2Up]

Since I was mentioned in Jon's last post, I find it necessary to say that I was not one of the people to send an email to Jon.  The one post I made in months and months is up earlier in this thread and you will need to make your own decision if you view the comment as worthy of the response it received.


I'm actually one who is sorry to see Jon leave the web presence.  From the beginning when I was asked to help out of the website content, I was very much in support of Jon's efforts.  Many of you probably aren't aware, but I put in somewhere near 60 hours of work updating member profiles and other MSTA web content only to have that work flushed away within a couple weeks when the club moved to a new web technology.  Even after that, I was in support of Jon.  I had a very long and successful career in IT and made suggestions to Jon and the EC.  All were rebuffed.  Some of our web and forum outages might have been avoided - who is to say.  I volunteered to chair a MSTA web/electronic presence board and this also was rebuffed.  Over the years Jon and my relationship has gone down hill and sometimes has popped up on the Forum.  I have been asked over the last couple years if I would have an interest working on the web presence and I can honestly say, that at one point in time I would have been honored to do so again, but my relationship with the club has slipped and my life style and travel would not allow me to even if I wanted to.
Like Jon, with the history of web issues and incidents that have happened to us at MSTA events, Lynn and I will have question whether we continue to be members.

[Michael Snyder]

So I will respond shortly to why the forum doesn't get much use but first I feel compelled to respond to the back and forth between Jon and Al.  Why, well allot of the "feuding" happened during my time as President  and yes I can be at fault.  Al very much offered service to the organization on several occasions and while I listened to what he had to say, (and yes Al we actually did do a few of things you recommended)I simply didn't think it was a good fit at the time.  Al is an awesome guy with nothing but good intentions and I would reach out an help him in anyway I can if he was ever in trouble, however Jon was my go to guy.  I have so much respect for Jon and what he has done and what he has given up for this organization it's not even funny.  Mistakes, sure we all have/had a few along the way but that is just part of life.  I felt like adding the dynamic between Al and Jon at such a critical time in the organization would not be in the best interest of the organization and therefore we never brought him on board.  Would things be different today, who knows no one does but I do know this Jon has received more hate mail and negative comments than anyone in this organization and mostly he shrugged them off but I knew and Tim Macy knew (cause we talked about it several times) that deep down inside it hurt and was steps backwards for the organization.  So Jon I say go ahead step down and live your life man, you definitely deserve it.  Just for those you that have not served as a volunteer you can't understand how hard a decision it is to just walk away.  I did it simply when it became personal and not about the organization.  As a volunteer for this organization there are so many rewarding moments but in the end its one or two that make it a pain in the ass.  Honestly, the day I stepped down was one of the saddest days of my life;  On my birthday which happen to be the day we were receiving the AMA award for the Road Riding Organization of the Year, I received a personal attack and death threat to me, my family and the other EC members.  That person was dealt with behind the scenes for almost a year (no longer a member so no worries)but still that's little compared to what Jon has endured for almost 8 years.  I raise my glass to you sir and say simply "Thank You!"

Now why doesn't the forum get used more often
Its not unique and offers no identity.  There is little information or resources other than direct MSTA stuff and unless you are "in the club" there is no benefit to coming here.  I am huge believer in the forum and check it almost everyday via tapatalk there is very little I want to get involved with topic wise.  Why,not because I don't want to know about events or raffles or mods or what not, there is just nothing new and what there is offers very little in the way of information.  I can get more information about specific bikes from bike specific forums or groups and that goes for almost any of the topics.  So unless I am planning to attend a specific event or interested in a specific program there is not much point in posting just for the sake of posting.

The forum however is (well can be) extremely useful in a marketing type environment when it comes to events and programs.  That however takes the event coordinator to post answers and provide information.There are couple of folks that do well at this Brick comes to mind and its nice to see.

Jim, you said you think its a good way to keep up with other members and that is so true however one of the things about the MSTA and it is still true today unfortunately is it is very much a "clicky" society.  People make friends tend to socialize with those they have the most in common with and often (not always) those are hard groups to penetrate.  Point being those small groups will tend to keep in touch via email, phone, facebook etc and there is not much need for another avenue.  Sorry but it's true.  The club has tried over the years to dispel and make that tendency go away with the MAP program for one but since the majority of new members are a result of old members bringing them into the fold there is not much use.

There is value here and can be great resource for sure but honestly it offers less than most forums when it comes to content and entertainment.  So how do you fix that find a niche unique to the MSTA and sport touring lifestyle that no one else offers and promote the crap out of it.  "If you build it they will come"

[Landon]

I obviously must not be involved enough with this organization, because I cannot think of a single reason that would drive a person to make personal attacks to another member. Let alone death threats. Any individual that would take anything this organization does that personal to make those types of actions must have serious problems in their life. Nothing is that important.

I don't blame anyone for not wanting to be a part of it.

[Michael Snyder]

He had a drinking problem Landon but we got him some help and guidance. 

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