MSTA Forums
Main Forums => General Discussion => Topic started by: DirtFlier on September 03, 2014, 06:07:24 pm
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There was an article in today's Cycle News that detailed the takeover of american road racing from DMG to a group led by Wayne Rainey, starting in 2015. The new group also has the support and guidance of DORNA which is the owner of WSB and motoGP. A few weeks ago, the leader of Dorna said in an interview that he wanted a revival of American road racing but gave no details at that time and I had no idea this was in the works. ;)
I hope this revives interest in road racing and it can't hurt because if they use the WSB specs, most manufacturers already have bikes built to that spec. It was the AMA/DMG weird specs that caused most mfgs to shy away from the joke of a series.
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That would be great news and I was hoping that the head of Dorna was hinting at some kind of positive development for AMA road racing when he said that.
Getting the manufacturers back (talking to you Honda) will be a good start. But they also have to do better marketing and getting it on TV. It will continue to be a niche product, but it had basically disappeared and become on par with some of the club racing.
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I hope they get back to VIR and Road Atlanta, two great tracks that allow camping and are interesting to get to (nice roads expecially from where I live).
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FANTASTIC NEWS. It takes a lot to get an old man excited, but color me excited. It may take some time but here's to hoping we can get viable series going once again. MId-Ohio here I come!!!!!!
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It would be nice to have a "spec series" for newbies where they would ride CBR250/300 or Kawasaki 250s with very limited mods. Ideally they would outlaw engine & electronic mods plus require that the standard fork and shock be used. Leaving the engine stock means it will easily last an entire season so greatly reduces the cost. Beginning racers need "seat time" most of all and not more horsepower or Ohlins suspension!
Once past this stage, they could try something like moto3. This is pretty much the path taken in Spain and perhaps Italy.
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This does sound very positive! Can't wait!
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[I hope they get back to VIR and Road Atlanta, two great tracks that allow camping and are interesting to get to (nice roads expecially from where I live)]
Neither of those really have any effect on tickets sold or the size of a TV audience. Many of the modern tracks in Europe have a "stadium section" where racers are in full view of the audience at least through several turns. This is contrary to VIR or RA, both beautiful and natural in their setting.
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Hopefully the rules will become such that the major manufactures will want back in. I believe that it will only be their influx of money that will allow teams to compete, and provide seats for riders. There does not seem to be enough sponsorship money from other companies to provide the level of support that teams need. I think that was one of the main mistakes that DMG made. They alienated the companies that built the series and counted on outside companies to pick up the slack, which never happened. This new development is certainly promising and I hope that it means better days ahead. Currently, I couldn't tell you a thing about this years AMA pro racing series, and I used to follow it very closely.
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[I hope they get back to VIR and Road Atlanta, two great tracks that allow camping and are interesting to get to (nice roads expecially from where I live)]
Neither of those really have any effect on tickets sold or the size of a TV audience. Many of the modern tracks in Europe have a "stadium section" where racers are in full view of the audience at least through several turns. This is contrary to VIR or RA, both beautiful and natural in their setting.
Well there are few if any tracks like that in the US. Not sure if maybe Austin has that, the only others that do are road circuits inside the ovals (Daytona, Indy, Fontana and others where AMA no longer races). Problem with Austin/Indy for this series is $$$, they'll want a lot and the promoters won't have it. I think they have to use mostly the existing road courses they've used in the past. Get more mfg. involved, and don't make up silly rules just to keep things competitive. (Though there is something to be said for a competitive series, not just 1-2 riders running away and winning every reace.)
Pat,
Feel the same way about AMA racing, this was only the second year I missed the event at Mid-Ohio. And since there was no TV coverage I didn't see a single event nor do I have any idea who was done what during the season. I look forward to improvements, returning to Mid-Ohio for the races and maybe adding another venue to the list of ones I've been to (VIR would be cool).
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Here is my plea to *All involved with motorcycle roadracing here in America as MotoAmerica prepares to take the helm from DMG:
http://motodog650.com/2014/09/08/a-plea-to-all-involved-with-motorcycle-roadracing-in-america/
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All, great comments and sentiments. BUT, and this is a big one (ha, ha), the new series will not prosper without support. SO, everyone needs to try and go to at least one event next season. Kind of like "Build it and they will come." We can't sit on the sidelines and see what this will develop into - must go to events. Heck, that is the only way they can judge how successful they are. And if it isn't covered on TV, then letter writing campaigns to the likes of FS1, and other TV outlets would be in order. Regarding the comments on tracks, there is a great little track in California where the AMA used to race all the time. It's called Willow Springs, out near Rosamond (Edward's AFB area). And the viewing there pretty much allows the whole track to be seen from the major viewing areas. I like the big venues as much as anyone, but maybe they need to start a little smaller and work (back) up to where they were. Just my $0.02 worth.
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[...there is a great little track in California where the AMA used to race all the time. It's called Willow Springs, out near Rosamond (Edward's AFB area). And the viewing there pretty much allows the whole track to be seen from the major viewing areas...]
Willow was used by all the Japanese motorcycle companies for testing since it was relatively close to their US headquarters in So Cal. One thing I always disliked about it were the track edges which had no safe runoff for a road racing bike. If you got off track, you needed a desert racing bike to survive! It may have changed by now.
The latest issue of Cycle New Online (free) has a nice interview with Wayne Rainey and he has good plans to get things off the ground. His new series will be called motoAmerica and in all my years at Honda, I never heard anyone say a bad word about Rainey, either here or in Japan, so he is well respected. At least for now, the plan is to retain SuperBike (1000) and Supersport (600) for the factory bikes and in the same SB races have 1000s for privateers on slicks and in SS races have 600s for privateers on DOT rubber. The old system with four separate races now becomes two races, a lot less confusing to spectators, and easier to fit into a day's races. And they are still working on a class similar to moto2 (identical engines but different chassis) but it's a long way off and getting the 1000s and 600s off the ground is their immediate goal.
Since they are working so closely with the FIM and Dorna (owner of motoGP & WSB), the SB specs will probably be identical to those used in Europe, which will make it a bunch easier for manufacturers to supply their American teams with bikes. And with the blessing of the FIM, motoAmerica is planning to have support races at both motoGP races next year, Indy and COTA.
They got FIM OK and backing to produce a TV reality series about young kids who are coming up through the system with a finale at one of the motoGP races. I just hope they don't make it "too much Hollywood" but hey, some publicity is better than no publicity. Overall, it's a very hopeful sign. :)
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Thanks for the info!
Curious if "1000" means that includes V-twins up to 1200cc to include EBracing and Ducati bikes??!!
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I would think the new rules will allow larger engines than 1000 cc but with some performance curbing add-ons to make it fair
EBR, with bags of money from Hero Motors in India, has been racing in WSB this year and if you said they were having a difficult time, it'd be an understatement. There have been many races where they fell outside the "107% rule" so failed to qualify or if they did get into the race, they finished well down the order and sometimes the engine expired during the race.
I'd venture a guess that WSB is far more competitive than motoGP when you look at how many different winners and brands exist. It's way more than Honda vs Yamaha in motoGP.
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Yeah....too bad I cant get WSB thru my local cable provider (TWC). I have to wait a week or so and hope it shows up on YOuTube...Usually does, but sometimes I have to settle for a language other than English!
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KTM AND MOTOAMERICA PARTNER TO ANNOUNCE NEW RC CUP RACING SERIES
http://www.ktm.com/us/news-events/news/all/details/ktm-and-motoamerica-partner-to-announce-new-rc-cup-racing-series.html#.VGUXsWfwuic
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In a recent Cycle News interview with Roger Hayden who will ride for Yoshimura Suzuki in the superbike class, the first race of their season is April 10-12 at COTA in Austin, which coincides with a motoGP race since Rainey wants to create as many possibilities as possible for American riders to show their stuff to the "furrin" high-dollar teams. :D
So far it looks like none of the factory teams will be at Daytona Speed Week in March, although track management claims to have motorcycle races planned.
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I used to go to Daytona with plans to see some racing. However, it's been several years since I've been. I'm heading that way this year, but with no plans to see any racing. It's mostly a chance to stretch my legs (and the bike's) going into the spring.
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I'd guess that over 98% of the people at Daytona Speed Week don't venture beyond Main Street. :(
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Why don't all y'all come down to Austin for the MotoGP/inaugural MotoAmerica weekend? We'll have a grand ol' time.
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Going to Austin is tempting...will have to see how the schedule shakes out a bit.
I'm keeping my fingers crossed for the Wayne Rainey Group. The only on-track racing at Daytona will be sponsored by the American SportBike Racing Association. And it appears that will be all of one day on Saturday March 14. Big whoop. Nothing against the folks participating in the series, but I'm not familiar with them at all. I'm sure they're ALL ridiculously fast compared to me. The ASRA is sanctioned by the AMA, but the ASRA web site describes themselves as "A notch above traditional sportsman club racing..." Again, way faster than me, but I wouldn't make the 1500 mile trip to see it.
I DO like the AMA Supercross and Flat Track. If I'm reading the schedule correctly, the Supercross will be held on March 7th in Daytona, and I won't be there that early. I may try to make the Flat Track on the 12th after the MSTA lunch get together. That would be the cap to a fun day.
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For at least the past decade, the supercross at Daytona has drawn the biggest crowd making the "Daytona 200" a real joke. Most years, you could toss a lit stick of dynamite into the front grandstands at the 200 and not bother anyone!
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I've been to several of the 200s, and I'd go again with the right motivation. And you're right about the attendance at the 200...notice I didn't say crowd. The attendance hardly justifies calling it a crowd.
Where I generally sat was where I could see the 1st turn into the infield/horseshoe. I could see as much action there as I think anywhere. Even at that, I don't think it's the best venue for spectators.
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The decline of racing at Daytona over the years has been stunning to me. I first went in 1972. Agostini, Renzo Pasolini, Kel Carruthers, and all the other world-famous riders were there. Daytona 200 was one of the most important races in the world.
Went to races every day, including MX & short track. Lots of dedicated fans there.
Last year I went, in '96, Daytona was full of drinking & partying Harley riders. If you said something about going to the races, the typical reaction was, "There's RACES?" (No they were not interested in going.)
Norm Kern
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I imagine that 99% of the people that go to Sturgis would be shocked to find out that it started out as a "racing event".
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For several years, Daytona was a world championship GP event for 250s and 500s so top riders in those classes came to FL. I can't remember why they stopped that?
The last time I went was in the mid-80s, when they had short track races for multiple nights at a local fairgrounds, the Alligator Enduro (guaranteed to ruin a bike!), the supercross, and road races which went on for 3-5 days, culminating with the 200 on Sunday. It was really a big deal although by that time, the drunks on Main Street had already rivaled the number of people there to watch races.
After my motocross support duties were over, I had to score for Mike Baldwin in the 200. It was the year of the dreaded Honda FWS V4 monsters that ate rear tires. Sitting next to me in the scoring stand was the mother of Miles Baldwin, a Canadian, and no relation to Mike. Each rider had to provide 3 lap scorers, situated at different places around the track and factory riders had plenty of warm bodies around but privateers had to enlist family members to score for them.
On an aside, some of the neer-do-wells in that race are still entering the 200 each year which gives you some idea of the quality level of American road racing! I'm pulling for Wayne to attract new blood into road racing and gradually get us back to the Roberts-Rainey-Schwantz-Lawson days when European factory teams actually came here to look for new riders.
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Like Norm I went a long time ago... in the early 80's but I went with a group who also partied. We did both we partied AND we went to all the road races. After a few years of that I started going to more of the "other" races. I really enjoyed the Flat Track races and watched the motocross because it was such a big show. 95% of those I met partying knew nothing about the races. It was a time when the Daytona track was still trying to attract the Harley crowd. They even made a back grandstand just for the Harley group. Lucifer's Hammer, a Harley powered road racer was still attempting to race so they had someone to cheer for. After they continued to prove that Harley's could not compete on the road race track you would not see Harley riders at the track any more! In the early years we always went to the infield and watched from there and went into the pits when we could. There you could smell the race bikes and see the small guy still attempting to compete with the growing big dollar teams. The one and two man teams run out of a van really spoke to me. They said it was still possible to "try" and to have fun! I met many a team from outside the USA who had saved and saw Daytona as the ultimate race that one had to attend and "try" at least once in a life time. That slowly was removed to be replaced by teams so dominant that the individual knew they never had a chance. After that racing, for me changed. I still enjoyed it but it was different, very different. It was corporate. There I go getting all romantic about it... hey that's the way I feel/felt about it. Root for the underdog!
YMMV!
The decline of racing at Daytona over the years has been stunning to me. I first went in 1972. Agostini, Renzo Pasolini, Kel Carruthers, and all the other world-famous riders were there. Daytona 200 was one of the most important races in the world.
Went to races every day, including MX & short track. Lots of dedicated fans there.
Last year I went, in '96, Daytona was full of drinking & partying Harley riders. If you said something about going to the races, the typical reaction was, "There's RACES?" (No they were not interested in going.)
Norm Kern
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One of the years that I was sent to Daytona, H-D brought Lucifer's Hammer for Jay Springsteen to ride. I took one look at it and felt sorry for Springsteen because no way would that bike keep up. It really belonged in their museum and not on the track.
As I suspected, it dropped out after making about a dozen laps but was never with the lead group.
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Whether you went to the last race of the DMG era or haven't been in 30 years PLEASE, get out to a race or two if at all possible and help in getting MotoAmerica off the ground and headed in the right direction !! Schedule below for your planning convenience:
Apr 10-12th: Circuit of the Americas – Austin, Texas (2 classes, MotoGP support races)
Apr 17-19th: Road Atlanta – Braselton, Georgia
May 15-17th: Virginia International Raceway (VIR) – Alton, Virginia
May 29-31st: Road America – Elkhart Lake, Wisconsin
June 12-14th: Barber Motorsports Park – Birmingham, Alabama
June 26-28th: Miller Motorsports Park – Tooele, Utah
July 17-19th: Mazda raceway Laguna Seca – Monterey, California (WSBK Support Race)
Aug 7-9th: Indianapolis Motor Speedway – Indianapolis, Indiana (2 classes, MotoGP support races)
Sep 11-13th: New Jersey Motorsports Park – Millville, New Jersey
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One of the years that I was sent to Daytona, H-D brought Lucifer's Hammer for Jay Springsteen to ride. I took one look at it and felt sorry for Springsteen because no way would that bike keep up. It really belonged in their museum and not on the track.
As I suspected, it dropped out after making about a dozen laps but was never with the lead group.
Hey Tosh,
Lucifer's Hammer probably retired due to a nail in the tire.
Today, it's the Harley riders themselves who are getting hammered.
If they had Lucifer's Hammer back when Daytona was run on the beach course, it would have pounded sand!
I'll shut up now...
Norm Kern
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I agree completely... we can't complain IF we don't support them! I'm planning on VIR at least! Looking at a few others!
Whether you went to the last race of the DMG era or haven't been in 30 years PLEASE, get out to a race or two if at all possible and help in getting MotoAmerica off the ground and headed in the right direction !! Schedule below for your planning convenience:
Apr 10-12th: Circuit of the Americas – Austin, Texas (2 classes, MotoGP support races)
Apr 17-19th: Road Atlanta – Braselton, Georgia
May 15-17th: Virginia International Raceway (VIR) – Alton, Virginia
May 29-31st: Road America – Elkhart Lake, Wisconsin
June 12-14th: Barber Motorsports Park – Birmingham, Alabama
June 26-28th: Miller Motorsports Park – Tooele, Utah
July 17-19th: Mazda raceway Laguna Seca – Monterey, California (WSBK Support Race)
Aug 7-9th: Indianapolis Motor Speedway – Indianapolis, Indiana (2 classes, MotoGP support races)
Sep 11-13th: New Jersey Motorsports Park – Millville, New Jersey
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Since the new series isn't coming to Mid-Ohio I've picked a few possible events and put them on my calendar. VIR, Barber and Road America top the list. Then maybe the Indy or Texas GP or possibly Laguna if I make a trip to LA and go with my brother there.
Sucks that they aren't coming to Mid-Ohio and some of us were discussing that after the bike show. My gut reaction is either due to keeping a small number of races, or that the Mid-Ohio wasn't interested or willing to do what they were asked. Heck they don't even have an event schedule up for 2015, and without the big motorcycle road racing and no more Indy or even sports cars they're down to vintage sports cars and bikes, and some tuner type or very low level series.
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Mid-Ohio's biggest single event is Motorcycle Vintage Days although they seem willing to send that one down the toilet with the others they've run into the ground. Ticket prices and booth rentals are always going up so it appears they are trying to reap too much from their cash cow.