Advanced Rider Training; Why don't you take it?

[Outlaws Justice]

I originally posted this up in a couple forums well over a year ago, But being that Those threads ran their course with some very good discussion I thought I would ask the questions of the riders here. I know all the usual answers will also come up but I want people to really think about this topic, SO here goes.



In my Free time I teach all types of motorsports at many levels, Dirt, Street, Track etc. I have been involved in Motorsports Education for 20 years and over the years I have noticed it has always been very difficult to get riders to participate or take any type of training once they learn how to ride, and many do not get training to learn how to ride in the first place either.

I know that some groups are more likely to search out rider training programs, advanced training programs and participate in training than others, ie. from my experience BMW riders tend to be represented in advanced riding classes way above the average and disproportionately in relation to the numbers of bikes sold and on the road. In some Classes they can account for almost 1/3 of the riders in advanced classes. (It does vary by region)

So my Question is to you the riders, Why do YOU not look for and participate in rider training, Advanced training etc. Why are you not trying to become a better rider and in turn a safer and more responsible rider? If you have taken a basic Rider course for a license or to learn why did you not follow up with more and advanced training?

I like to equate rider training to our formal education, completion of the Basic classes like the MSF BRC is about the same as graduating from the 3rd grade. You did not quite school after the third grade but most riders tend to be of the opinion that the 3rd grade level of rider education is enough. There is so much more out there that can make you a better rider, and in turn might actually even save your life, so what prevents you from wanting to be better? I know some of you think, "I am a good rider" if that is the case, good in comparison to who? Don't you want to be better? Even track day guys? If you are not mixing it up with Rossi you can be better, so again whats the deal?

I am looking for the honest opinions of those who have not taken training, maybe you thought about it but just never did? Again why? Advanced training?? There is so much out there what is holding you back?
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[Brick]

I do take advanced training every couple of years.

[Patmo]

Dave....

I'm willing to bet that far over 50% of MSTA members have already taken some kind of rider training training.  And I'll bet that more than 1/2 of those that haven't already taken some, plan to do so in the future.
Your pretty much preaching to the choir here.   . 

[RIDEMYST]

The Boss and I usually take some sort of training course every 3 - 4 years.
We also ride to a local park and challenge each other on cornering and braking skills and stopping and starting on steep inclines.
Motorcycling, like any other sport, improved skills come with knowledge and practice. -JEP-

[Outlaws Justice]

Dave....

I'm willing to bet that far over 50% of MSTA members have already taken some kind of rider training training.  And I'll bet that more than 1/2 of those that haven't already taken some, plan to do so in the future.
Your pretty much preaching to the choir here.    .

Not disagreeing on your numbers, But if 50% have, what about the other 50% and the question remains, Why. With fellow riders around that do they cannot say they don't know the benefit or need.

[dpippin]

The Boss and I usually take some sort of training course every 3 - 4 years.
We also ride to a local park and challenge each other on cornering and braking skills and stopping and starting on steep inclines.
Motorcycling, like any other sport, improved skills come with knowledge and practice. -JEP-

That's commendable, but where do you find steep inclines in Florida?

Doug

[RIDEMYST]

That's commendable, but where do you find steep inclines in Florida?

Doug
[/quote]

I knew somebody was going to ask that!
Actually they are man made hills (fill piles) sodded and landscaped. However, your ears don't pop when you get to the top. -JEP-

[qman8]

Its always the same answer....TIME AND MONEY!    Yes, we all SHOULD take the time and spend the money to become better riders.  I'd also like to take the time and money to do a lot of other things as well.

[stevegrab]

Its always the same answer....TIME AND MONEY!    Yes, we all SHOULD take the time and spend the money to become better riders.  I'd also like to take the time and money to do a lot of other things as well.

Yep money first (I'm really cheap, not that I cannot afford or don't have the money) time (even as a single person with no family I'm often trying to find time to do all I want). When it comes down to riding or taking some training I choose riding every time.

I did take the MSF class before I started in my early 30s (rode a moped and clutchless Honda Trail bike in my early years). I thought about and considered taking more training, be it an MSF ERC, Stayin Safe, a track day or something else. Just never got around to it.

I agree that for the MSTA in general many folks have or will, and those that haven't have most of the same reasons as others. While the classes at STAR are a good idea, I've had trouble trying to work those things into my schedule.

When I really boil it down, just not something I'm making a high priority. I could find the time and money if it were. Maybe deep down I'm afraid of knowing what I'm doing wrong. (Trying to be honest, not silly.)

[qman8]

The 2 instructional track days I took were awesome, even if it did scare the crap outta me.  Best place to learn higher speed techniques.  Even the couple of classroom trainings I took were extremely helpful.  I'm as guilty as the next guy for having bad riding habits, and lord knows I need more off-road skills.  I wish there was a place close to where I live that would provide that training.  None available that I know of. 

As for rider training at STAR, I would not be interested.  Why?  I'm there to socialize, see new places, and ride new roads.  I'm not there to train, or push my limits far from home.

[HawkGTRider]

As for rider training at STAR, I would not be interested.  Why?  I'm there to socialize, see new places, and ride new roads.  I'm not there to train, or push my limits far from home.

You are probably closer to opportunities for training than some. Imagine living a half-day+ from the nearest available training of any kind, and even a one-day opportunity for training becomes a BIG chunk out of your annual vacation. With that in mind, I think some sort of training event on one end or the other of a rally makes fine sense. I would almost say that I'm not inclined to take a rally day since I'm there to socialize and such. But if there were several people taking the same class, it would be a good opportunity to socialize AND learn.

[Outlaws Justice]

When I really boil it down, just not something I'm making a high priority. I could find the time and money if it were. Maybe deep down I'm afraid of knowing what I'm doing wrong. (Trying to be honest, not silly.)



At the end of the day I think you were more honest than most will ever admit. I am always afraid to look bad in front of peers while in training, but that is something I have gotten over with Age. Now I am the first to admit I do not know it all and that others ride better than me so I am always looking for things to help me improve.


Instead of spending money on the latest gizmo, or that fancy pipe to get you 3 more H.P. maybe use that money to become a better rider. I look at some peoples bikes with 1,000  or more in mods and figure that they could have improved there riding more with a class than all that stuff they did to the bike. But of course then they would not have anything to show off to their friends.

[Landon]

Instead of spending money on the latest gizmo, or that fancy pipe to get you 3 more H.P. maybe use that money to become a better rider. I look at some peoples bikes with 1,000  or more in mods and figure that they could have improved there riding more with a class than all that stuff they did to the bike. But of course then they would not have anything to show off to their friends.

I guess I disagree and don't feel its anyone's place to tell someone else how to spend THEIR money. If they want to spend their money on a gizmo that's their business.

I'm not saying I couldn't learn something from an advanced training course, but I am very comfortable with they way I currently ride and can carry a pace that I am happy with. Sure, Rossi would smoke me but I ride my bike on public roads and have never rolled onto a race track.

I guess as others have said I don't feel its a priority. There is certainly no guarantee that is will make you a better rider. For what its worth I've also not taken any advanced training on how to drive a car since I completed drivers education as a teen.

[qman8]

 "For what its worth I've also not taken any advanced training on how to drive a car since I completed drivers education as a teen."

....What a better world it would be if everyone were required to pass periodic Advanced car driving training to keep their license!  I'm continually amazed at the poor driving skills witnessed on the streets.  One example is how most drivers will brake late at the apex of a turn.... right when they should be accelerating.

[TN2Wheeler]

"For what its worth I've also not taken any advanced training on how to drive a car since I completed drivers education as a teen."

....What a better world it would be if everyone were required to pass periodic Advanced car driving training to keep their license!  I'm continually amazed at the poor driving skills witnessed on the streets.  One example is how most drivers will brake late at the apex of a turn.... right when they should be accelerating.

Driving, or for that matter riding, skills are not important to the vast majority of Americans. It's just a means to an end. If it were 98% of our cars wouldn't have automatic transmissions and there wouldn't be so much interest in driverless cars.